1. #113941
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="lawl"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="bigblue4417"][quote user="Morehead State"]


    [quote user="bigblue4417"]I don't think you are giving enough credit to Eli MH. We are all taught from a young age that if the ball hits your hands you should catch it...
    [/quote]</p>


    I'll ask you to look at the list that Dezz posted.* All those picks that he actually holds Eli responsible for.* Almost all can in games we lost.* They cost us the TN game, the second Dallas game and the first Philly game.</p>


    Eli's turnovers, blamed on Eli by an Eli apologist, clearly cost us three games last year.</p>


    [/quote]
    As far as Eli goes, I am much more with you than I am with them. But I do think you need to cut him a little slack. Let's not even talk about sliding down and holding onto the ****ing ball. lol
    [/quote]</p>


    Just drives me nuts the blinders some guys have with Eli.* I'm not saying he's bad QB.* I think he's well above average and quite honestly has made the most of his ability. (He's not exactly the most athletic guy).* But this "gunslinger" nonsense and blaming everyone under the sun for his poor decisions or poor passes drives me nuts.</p>


    He still panics in the pocket and rushes throws, often into coverage.* Thats not what a "gunslinger' does.** "Gunslinger" take hits in order to wait for a guy to break open.</p>


    [/quote]

    u try to pretend that balls the bounce of WRs hands are bad decisions, when in reality they are just bad plays by the WRs for not making the grabs


    annnnddd here we go againnnn

    Pappy makes his own definition of what a word means and expects us all to follow
    [/quote]</p>


    Those were mostly poor throws.* he tended to get the ball up early in games last year.</p>


    But when you look at Dez's video, you see some absolutely horrible decisions. Real high school stuff.</p>


    [/quote]

    again either way i'd imagine that some of those balls are just completely unable to be determined WHOSE fault it is - both ways

    I'll break it down when I ge thome
    [/quote]</p>


    The Eli Cultists seem to be able to determine it very easily.......Its always someone else's fault.</p>[/quote]

    more like realists

    we understand that QBs INTs go up in Gilbrides system

    and anybody whose played football knows tha tballs don't alwyas come perfect to you, but if you get two hands on, even if u have to move ur arms up down to the right or left, its on YOU to get the job done
    [/quote]
    Just like every WR isn't perfect and isn't going to catch everything.

    The more passes you throw that are "hard" to catch then the more drops/tips you're going to have and thus more interceptions.

    It happens to eli more because he creates an opportunity for it to happen.[/quote]

    see but i disagree at the assessment that any ball that isn't thrown perfectly is hard ball to cathc. Readjusting is part of the job - its obviously more difficult than catching a ball in stride wide open compared to catching a ball that get to u in the crowd where u may have to jump -- but this is what WRs are brought here to do.* You HAVE to make those plays and if u dont, its not "well that was a tough one" its "you GOTTA make that play"
    [/quote]

    Similarly, Eli has GOTTA make a better throw on those same plays.


  2. #113942
    Hall of Famer MattMeyerBud's Avatar
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="bigblue4417"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="bigblue4417"][quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="bigblue4417"][quote user="Morehead State"]


    [quote user="bigblue4417"]I don't think you are giving enough credit to Eli MH. We are all taught from a young age that if the ball hits your hands you should catch it...
    [/quote]</p>


    I'll ask you to look at the list that Dezz posted. All those picks that he actually holds Eli responsible for. Almost all can in games we lost. They cost us the TN game, the second Dallas game and the first Philly game.</p>


    Eli's turnovers, blamed on Eli by an Eli apologist, clearly cost us three games last year.</p>


    [/quote]
    As far as Eli goes, I am much more with you than I am with them. But I do think you need to cut him a little slack. Let's not even talk about sliding down and holding onto the ****ing ball. lol
    [/quote]</p>


    Just drives me nuts the blinders some guys have with Eli. I'm not saying he's bad QB. I think he's well above average and quite honestly has made the most of his ability. (He's not exactly the most athletic guy). But this "gunslinger" nonsense and blaming everyone under the sun for his poor decisions or poor passes drives me nuts.</p>


    He still panics in the pocket and rushes throws, often into coverage. Thats not what a "gunslinger' does. "Gunslinger" take hits in order to wait for a guy to break open.</p>[/quote]
    I totally agree. I always have a sinking feeling when Eli starts running around or is getting pressured. It's almost like most of the time you expect him to throw a pick vs make a nice pass. I have confidence in him but you just never know sometimes.....I expect him to be much better this year however.
    [/quote]

    how many QBs do you NOT get that feelings for when they are forced out of the pocket or under pressure?

    Isn't that exactly WHY we go so DE heavy? TO put that pressure on people? lol
    [/quote]
    Of the top QB's in the league, none of them. When you see Rodgers, Phillip, Peyton, Brady, Ben, Brees, Schaub or maybe even Romo run out of the pocket or get pressured f they don't see it they throw it away or run out of bounds. I don't care about them as much as Eli obviously but Morehead is right about making better decisions. I know Eli is not the most mobile guy but that pick to SS12 against the Colts is an example. He runs away and then throws it into triple coverage. Why?
    [/quote]

    I would have to take Mobile QBs out of the mix just because if they have the threat to be decent with th erun its not an issue

    but have u ever seen Peyton out of the pocket? Its one of the scariest things to see lol

    Either way, why do we invest so much money into pass rushers? Answer that and you'll have your reality

  3. #113943
    Hall of Famer MattMeyerBud's Avatar
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="Morehead State"]

    He panics in the pocket and throws into coverage in the face of a pass rush.</p>


    It doesn't matter what system he's in. This is your "gunlinger".</p>[/quote]

    He doesn't panic I just don't see that AT ALL, he does throw into coverage...because he has a tremendous amount of confidence in his ability to get the ball to his receivers....does that cause a few more ints then someone like Kyle Orton or Sanchez or another game management type QB...sure...but it also results in plays like The Helmet Catch by David Tyree....you have to take that good with that bad....now last year...If you look at Eli's stats last year and make his 25 Ints 16 or 17.....it makes him look much better...and that would be a better representation of how he actually played because AT LEAST 8 or 9 of those int's last year were picture perfect placement and just ricocheted off our talented...yet young and inexperienced receivers hands, did he also throw into coverage and cause a few int's himself....of course....but you can't just ignore the plain fact that he made many good passes last year that ended up being int's.
    [/quote]

    see like i dont even want to give Moorehead that inch to say that sometimes he does, because he takes that and runs and exaggerates it and makes it seem like its much more common and an issue than it is

    but sometimes Eli DOES get happy feet - but again thats because i am being hoenst about the situation

  4. #113944
    Hall of Famer Morehead State's Avatar
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="Morehead State"]


    He panics in the pocket and throws into coverage in the face of a pass rush.</P>


    It doesn't matter what system he's in. This is your "gunlinger".</P>


    [/quote]

    He doesn't panic I just don't see that AT ALL, he does throw into coverage...because he has a tremendous amount of confidence in his ability to get the ball to his receivers....does that cause a few more ints then someone like Kyle Orton or Sanchez or another game management type QB...sure...but it also results in plays like The Helmet Catch by David Tyree....you have to take that good with that bad....now last year...If you look at Eli's stats last year and make his 25 Ints 16 or 17.....it makes him look much better...and that would be a better representation of how he actually played because AT LEAST 8 or 9 of those int's last year were picture perfect placement and just ricocheted off our talented...yet young and inexperienced receivers hands, did he also throw into coverage and cause a few int's himself....of course....but you can't just ignore the plain fact that he made many good passes last year that ended up being int's.
    [/quote]</P>


    Don't even try to bring up the helmet catch. that was desperation time in the game. There are times when you have to take huge risks.</P>


    I saw maybe one or two "good" passes that were picked. the rest were either high or thrown behind the WR or both.</P>


    He panics in the face of the pass rush. Period. Its what Eli does.He doesn't wait in the pocket and be willing to take the hit to allow time for a WR to break open (like Phil did). He chucks and ducks a lot. By the way, so does Peyton. But Peyton is just a lot better at it than Eli.</P>


    As Tom Coughlin and Morehead State both say.....He's has to throw it away more and be willing to take more sacks.</P>
    "Typical Morehead!"..................and he didn't even mean that as a compliment..

  5. #113945
    Hall of Famer MattMeyerBud's Avatar
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="lawl"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="lawl"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="bigblue4417"][quote user="Morehead State"]


    [quote user="bigblue4417"]I don't think you are giving enough credit to Eli MH. We are all taught from a young age that if the ball hits your hands you should catch it...
    [/quote]</p>


    I'll ask you to look at the list that Dezz posted. All those picks that he actually holds Eli responsible for. Almost all can in games we lost. They cost us the TN game, the second Dallas game and the first Philly game.</p>


    Eli's turnovers, blamed on Eli by an Eli apologist, clearly cost us three games last year.</p>


    [/quote]
    As far as Eli goes, I am much more with you than I am with them. But I do think you need to cut him a little slack. Let's not even talk about sliding down and holding onto the ****ing ball. lol
    [/quote]</p>


    Just drives me nuts the blinders some guys have with Eli. I'm not saying he's bad QB. I think he's well above average and quite honestly has made the most of his ability. (He's not exactly the most athletic guy). But this "gunslinger" nonsense and blaming everyone under the sun for his poor decisions or poor passes drives me nuts.</p>


    He still panics in the pocket and rushes throws, often into coverage. Thats not what a "gunslinger' does. "Gunslinger" take hits in order to wait for a guy to break open.</p>


    [/quote]

    u try to pretend that balls the bounce of WRs hands are bad decisions, when in reality they are just bad plays by the WRs for not making the grabs


    annnnddd here we go againnnn

    Pappy makes his own definition of what a word means and expects us all to follow
    [/quote]</p>


    Those were mostly poor throws. he tended to get the ball up early in games last year.</p>


    But when you look at Dez's video, you see some absolutely horrible decisions. Real high school stuff.</p>


    [/quote]

    again either way i'd imagine that some of those balls are just completely unable to be determined WHOSE fault it is - both ways

    I'll break it down when I ge thome
    [/quote]</p>


    The Eli Cultists seem to be able to determine it very easily.......Its always someone else's fault.</p>[/quote]

    more like realists

    we understand that QBs INTs go up in Gilbrides system

    and anybody whose played football knows tha tballs don't alwyas come perfect to you, but if you get two hands on, even if u have to move ur arms up down to the right or left, its on YOU to get the job done
    [/quote]
    Just like every WR isn't perfect and isn't going to catch everything.

    The more passes you throw that are "hard" to catch then the more drops/tips you're going to have and thus more interceptions.

    It happens to eli more because he creates an opportunity for it to happen.[/quote]

    see but i disagree at the assessment that any ball that isn't thrown perfectly is hard ball to cathc. Readjusting is part of the job - its obviously more difficult than catching a ball in stride wide open compared to catching a ball that get to u in the crowd where u may have to jump -- but this is what WRs are brought here to do. You HAVE to make those plays and if u dont, its not "well that was a tough one" its "you GOTTA make that play"
    [/quote]

    Similarly, Eli has GOTTA make a better throw on those same plays.[/quote]

    well again we would have to break dwon specific plays on that though

    I am SURE there are balls he has to make better throws on, but I also remembering some balls being put in places wher eonly the WR can get to and the WR not making the play. OR maybe Eli felt that where the ball was going was the safest place to put it...


  6. #113946
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    umps robbed the yanks baaad last night.

  7. #113947
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    Has anyone EVER seen Eli step into his throw when about to get hit instead of shy away? Because i haven't.

    He'll I've seen one preseason game of Ryan perilloux's and he's done it.

  8. #113948
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="Morehead State"]


    He panics in the pocket and throws into coverage in the face of a pass rush.</p>


    It doesn't matter what system he's in. This is your "gunlinger".</p>


    [/quote]

    He doesn't panic I just don't see that AT ALL, he does throw into coverage...because he has a tremendous amount of confidence in his ability to get the ball to his receivers....does that cause a few more ints then someone like Kyle Orton or Sanchez or another game management type QB...sure...but it also results in plays like The Helmet Catch by David Tyree....you have to take that good with that bad....now last year...If you look at Eli's stats last year and make his 25 Ints 16 or 17.....it makes him look much better...and that would be a better representation of how he actually played because AT LEAST 8 or 9 of those int's last year were picture perfect placement and just ricocheted off our talented...yet young and inexperienced receivers hands, did he also throw into coverage and cause a few int's himself....of course....but you can't just ignore the plain fact that he made many good passes last year that ended up being int's.
    [/quote]</p>


    Don't even try to bring up the helmet catch. that was desperation time in the game. There are times when you have to take huge risks.</p>


    I saw maybe one or two "good" passes that were picked. the rest were either high or thrown behind the WR or both.</p>


    He panics in the face of the pass rush. Period. Its what Eli does.He doesn't wait in the pocket and be willing to take the hit to allow time for a WR to break open (like Phil did). He chucks and ducks a lot. By the way, so does Peyton. But Peyton is just a lot better at it than Eli.</p>


    As Tom Coughlin and Morehead State both say.....He's has to throw it away more and be willing to take more sacks.</p>[/quote]

    and after the games where those tipped INTs happened hes also gone on to say that the WRs had to make those plays

    it works both ways...

    QBs are awlays going to throw INTs and make mistakes

    the point is ELis inflated number is really an over exaggeration of how much change he needs to make

  9. #113949
    Hall of Famer Morehead State's Avatar
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="MattMeyerBud"][quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="Morehead State"]


    He panics in the pocket and throws into coverage in the face of a pass rush.</P>


    It doesn't matter what system he's in. This is your "gunlinger".</P>


    [/quote]

    He doesn't panic I just don't see that AT ALL, he does throw into coverage...because he has a tremendous amount of confidence in his ability to get the ball to his receivers....does that cause a few more ints then someone like Kyle Orton or Sanchez or another game management type QB...sure...but it also results in plays like The Helmet Catch by David Tyree....you have to take that good with that bad....now last year...If you look at Eli's stats last year and make his 25 Ints 16 or 17.....it makes him look much better...and that would be a better representation of how he actually played because AT LEAST 8 or 9 of those int's last year were picture perfect placement and just ricocheted off our talented...yet young and inexperienced receivers hands, did he also throw into coverage and cause a few int's himself....of course....but you can't just ignore the plain fact that he made many good passes last year that ended up being int's.
    [/quote]

    see like i dont even want to give Moorehead that inch to say that sometimes he does, because he takes that and runs and exaggerates it and makes it seem like its much more common and an issue than it is

    but sometimes Eli DOES get happy feet - but again thats because i am being hoenst about the situation
    [/quote]</P>


    I don't give a **** about happy feet. Happy feet is overrated as a problem. He is NOT patient in the pocket. He's does not stand tall in the pocket like Brady. He chucks the ball very often too damn soon.</P>
    "Typical Morehead!"..................and he didn't even mean that as a compliment..

  10. #113950
    Hall of Famer MattMeyerBud's Avatar
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    Re: THEE SWAG THREAD

    [quote user="lawl"]Has anyone EVER seen Eli step into his throw when about to get hit instead of shy away? Because i haven't.

    He'll I've seen one preseason game of Ryan perilloux's and he's done it.[/quote]

    see like whats the response to that

    yes i have..

    like people see that comment and they literally think hes NEVER done it - its a crock

    I do admit he gets happy feet sometimes, but its no where near as bad as some people are making it seem

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