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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drez View Post
    Yes, he probably did. So, then he got the money a few months sooner, as in one check in March as opposed to getting it in paychecks throughout the season? That seems a pretty minor detail to me, really. And to be completely honest, and to clarify since I wasn't being very specific, when I said it didn't affect when he got the money, I was talking more about the calendar/season year, meaning he was going to get that money in 2012.
    Its a minor point but that's not what you meant at all.
    I said that he got the money up front and you retorted that it didn't effect when he got the money.
    Lets keep it real here my friend.
    "Phil Simms is the greatest QB in Giants history" ........Mahatma Gandhi

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
    And you missed what I said entirely.

    The slot position manufacturers yards. Probably in the range of 600-800 yards. It's easy to replace that yardage with a new player. Cruz's value is what he does beyond that. Turning the 600-800 yards into 1100-1500 yards.
    And without Cruz adding those yards, we would not have won the SB. Plain and simple.
    I would never argue that Nicks isn't far more important a player. I think Nicks is a top 5 WR. But I would also not suggest that Cruz can be easily replaced by a 600-800 yard WR. The kid has proven that he can play. I wouldn't pay him top 10 money, but I'm not going to suggest he doesn't deserve something in the $5 to $6 MM/year range. Which is a hell of a lot more than a 600-800 yard "Jason Avante" type player would get.
    "Phil Simms is the greatest QB in Giants history" ........Mahatma Gandhi

  3. #63
    All-Pro slipknottin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morehead State View Post
    And without Cruz adding those yards, we would not have won the SB. Plain and simple.
    I would never argue that Nicks isn't far more important a player. I think Nicks is a top 5 WR. But I would also not suggest that Cruz can be easily replaced by a 600-800 yard WR. The kid has proven that he can play. I wouldn't pay him top 10 money, but I'm not going to suggest he doesn't deserve something in the $5 to $6 MM/year range. Which is a hell of a lot more than a 600-800 yard "Jason Avante" type player would get.
    Sigh. You clearly are missing my point.

    Like I said, his value is closer to A receiver who is around 800-1000 yards. Not a guy who has 1,500 yards
    Last edited by slipknottin; 02-19-2013 at 02:10 PM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
    Sigh. You clearly are missing my point.
    Well dumb it down for me.
    You say that Cruz should get paid like a 600-800 yard WR. I say that's nuts. You say all we need is a 600-800 yard replacement for Cruz. Is it your view that a 600-800 yard WR would produce like Cruz does in the slot. If so, show me the evidence.
    "Phil Simms is the greatest QB in Giants history" ........Mahatma Gandhi

  5. #65
    All-Pro slipknottin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morehead State View Post
    Well dumb it down for me.
    You say that Cruz should get paid like a 600-800 yard WR. I say that's nuts. You say all we need is a 600-800 yard replacement for Cruz. Is it your view that a 600-800 yard WR would produce like Cruz does in the slot. If so, show me the evidence.
    No. The slot position creates 600-800 yards. Cruz should get paid off what he creates on top of that. Somewhere around 800-1000 yards. Max he should get is about the contract colston got. 5 year ~37 mil


    I'm saying any moderately intelligent/tough receiver would have 600-800 yards in the slot. Not that you can take any 600-800 yard receiver and get 1,500 yards out of them by moving them to the slot

  6. #66
    What makes Cruz special is what he does after the catch, which is something that not many other slot receivers can do. With that being said, numbers tend to be inflated when a receiver is playing in the slot compared to what he would do on the outside especially when you take into account the system that is run here. I find it similar to Welker in Miami vs Welker in New England. The man should be paid like an elite slot receiver, but he shouldn't sniff Fitzgerald money and shouldn't make more than someone like Nicks.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
    No. The slot position creates 600-800 yards. Cruz should get paid off what he creates on top of that. Somewhere around 800-1000 yards. Max he should get is about the contract colston got. 5 year ~37 mil


    I'm saying any moderately intelligent/tough receiver would have 600-800 yards in the slot. Not that you can take any 600-800 yard receiver and get 1,500 yards out of them by moving them to the slot
    OK...Now you're making no sense.
    You said in a previous post that Cruz should make "600-800 yards WR" money. Now you say he should be paid like Marcus Colston, who is a heck of a lot better than a 600-800 yard WR.
    And makes a hell of a lot more money than the pedestrian contract you say Cruz is worth.
    What the hell, Slippy!!!

    here's your comment......

    "My point is he should be paid like a 600-900 yard receiver."
    "Phil Simms is the greatest QB in Giants history" ........Mahatma Gandhi

  8. #68
    All-Pro slipknottin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morehead State View Post
    OK...Now you're making no sense.
    You said in a previous post that Cruz should make "600-800 yards WR" money. Now you say he should be paid like Marcus Colston, who is a heck of a lot better than a 600-800 yard WR.
    And makes a hell of a lot more money than the pedestrian contract you say Cruz is worth.
    What the hell, Slippy!!!
    I never said Cruz should get paid like he's a 600-800 yard receiver. Try reading again.

    Cruz turned that 600-800 yards into 1,500 yards. That difference is what he is actually worth.

    Colston is mostly a slot receiver as well. Who has similar numbers to Cruz.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
    I never said Cruz should get paid like he's a 600-800 yard receiver. Try reading again.

    Cruz turned that 600-800 yards into 1,500 yards. That difference is what he is actually worth.

    Colston is mostly a slot receiver as well. Who has similar numbers to Cruz.
    You didn't?..........

    "I never said anything about Cruz not being a good player. My point is he should be paid like a 600-900 yard receiver. Not a 1,500 yard receiver. If Cruz expects to be one of the highest paid receivers in the league he can find that money elsewhere. The giants meanwhile will find someone else who makes almost nothing and get 800 or so yards from them in the slot position".....


    .....Love,

    Slippy
    "Phil Simms is the greatest QB in Giants history" ........Mahatma Gandhi

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by RoanokeFan View Post
    Next year or this year? I agree for 2013, but not for 2014 nexcessarily
    I wouldnt be so sure about even this year. Cruz is a RFA... Meaning he can field offers from other teams. The giants have the right to match any offer. if the offer is some CRAZY money then the giants will have to let him go. end of story. Also according to another Thread the Giants may not use their franchise tag. I thought they might with Cruz.. so there is no Guarantee that we start 2013 with both of them
    Football has been very, very good to us.
    Even though 2013 was a losing season, we can console ourselves with this fact-

    # of Super Bowl victories since 1985:

    1-Chicago, St. Louis, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, New Orleans, Seattle
    2-Washington, Green Bay, Denver, Pittsburgh, Baltimore
    3-San Francisco, Dallas, New England
    4-New York Giants!!!!!

    Let's make it 5 in 2014 !!!

    ***Stat provided by "Schloss22"***

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