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  1. #11

    Williams Is Good But....

    Williams is a good pick perhaps for the second round. I absolutely love the idea of drafting a BIG DT in the first or second round. A run stopper the can plug the middle. We need an anchor in order to allow our edge rushers to get home and do their job. If we were going to use our first round pick on a BIG DT I think this is where we should go:

    Johnathan Jenkins
    6-3⅝, 346 lbs - Georgia
    Versus the Run 1 Massive two-gap NT with wide trunk and thick legs. Has adequate-to-good initial quickness and body control for size. Has tree trunks for arms and flashes ability to lock out. Good upper body strength (30 reps on bench). Has quick hands and flashes ability to shed and make tackles in confined area. Also makes a surprising number of play in pursuit for his size. However, pads tend to rise when he wears down. He will give up ground initially but more often than not he's able to recover. Can develop into a highly effective two-gap run defender if he keeps weight down, becomes more consistent with leverage and develops into more of a technician with his hands.
    Pass Rush Skills 4 Does not offer much in this area. Has enough initial quickness, size and power to collapse the pocket once in a while. But lacks the initial burst, lateral agility and closing burst to consistently disrupt.
    Quickness (hands/feet) 2 Quicker and more athletic than the perception. Surprises with agility and balance on tape. Needs to be more consistent and violent with his hand usage but flashes very quick hands when disengaging from blocks.
    Toughness/Motor 2 Falsely stereotyped as lazy on the field. Yes, he will wear down as game wears on but he plays with a much better motor than most 320-plus pound NT/DT types. Will pursue downfield. Flashes a mean streak.


    He is expected to go around the 25th pick just in time for us to grab him. So that he does not tire out in games we could play in on first and second, running downs, and bring in our speed rushers for passing downs.
    In addition it has been a year or so since we selected a defensive lineman in the first round. :-) What do you guys think of him? GO Big Blue!!!!


  2. #12
    All-Pro titwio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AGiantDynasty View Post
    I just can't see this happen. The Vikings NEED picks to rebuild. They wont give a 2nd up just to move up 6 spots.

    Not to mention we have Jenkins and LJ in the middle. I seriously doubt we take a DT with our first..

    Nice attempt and thanks for sharing your thoughts with us, but I just don't see this happening.

    Personally I'm still hoping for the "boring" draft of:

    1) CB Rhodes - CB and Safety depth and versatility
    2) LB Greene - Solid all around LB
    3) OL BPA
    4) DL BPA
    Jenkins is 32 years old and injury prone....His strength is rushing the passer not stopping the run. Then they have Shaun Rogers who's 34 years old coming off a year away from football. Marvin Austin hasn't shown much and that leaves the Giants with Linval and 27 year old 7th round pick Markus Kuhn. Whether you doubt it or not, DT is a need for the Giants.

    I too appreciate for what your "hoping" for but there's a GREAT chance Rhodes won't be there at 19. He's actually one of my favorite prospects but he's the second rated corner coming off a great workout at his pro day that improved from his impressive workout at the combine. He's likely going top 15 if not sooner. Greene may be there but then what. Kind of hard to say you can't see things happening and then give an example that's not thought out or unrealistic while listing obvious names.

    I admit the trade for the 2nd round pick may have been a bit ambitious but I really don't see how they wouldn't make that deal for a 3rd if that really is the value based on that kind of trade. Do you have any other plans or moves you'd like to see if and when Rhodes is not available? There's things like value to take into consideration when taking players and they just don't do BPA OL in the 3rd and BPA DL in the 4th. I do appreciate the input though.
    Last edited by titwio; 03-22-2013 at 10:12 PM.

  3. #13
    I like your ideas but I think the vikes are going to have to move higher then 19 to get Austin, they would need to get ahead of the rams at 16

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by titwio View Post
    Jenkins is 32 years old and injury prone....His strength is rushing the passer not stopping the run. Then they have Shaun Rogers who's 34 years old coming off a year away from football. Marvin Austin hasn't shown much and that leaves the Giants with Linval and 27 year old 7th round pick Markus Kuhn. Whether you doubt it or not, DT is a need for the Giants.

    I too appreciate for what your "hoping" for but there's a GREAT chance Rhodes won't be there at 19. He's actually one of my favorite prospects but he's the second rated corner coming off a great workout at his pro day that improved from his impressive workout at the combine. He's likely going top 15 if not sooner. Greene may be there but then what. Kind of hard to say you can't see things happening and then give an example that's not thought out or unrealistic while listing obvious names.

    I admit the trade for the 2nd round pick may have been a bit ambitious but I really don't see how they wouldn't make that deal for a 3rd if that really is the value based on that kind of trade. Do you have any other plans or moves you'd like to see if and when Rhodes is not available? There's things like value to take into consideration when taking players and they just don't do BPA OL in the 3rd and BPA DL in the 4th. I do appreciate the input though.
    How can you dismiss (for lack of.a better term) my draft and because Rhodes might not be there but yet you can have a 2nd round talent going in the 4th? Rhodes is slated to go around the 15-20th pick, which means we have a realistic chance to get him.

    Also, why is it so hard to say rd 3 and 4 to draft the BPA OL or DL? This draft has its best depth for OL and DL between the 2nd and 4th rounds. Its very much possible to say draft the BPA at that point.

    I don't hate your mock, but I certainly feel mine is slightly more possible to actually happen. DT is certainly a need, but a run stuffer DT in the first seems like a huge reach. When was the last run defender the giants took in the 1st rd?

  5. #15
    Veteran TAILGATIN''s Avatar
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    Titwio? Shoulda went with boob instead. Just kiddin but I hate ur mock

    "Behold, the tailgate party. The pinnacle of human achievement. Since the dawn of parking lots, man has sought to fill his gut with food and alcohol in anticipation of watching others exercise."
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  6. #16
    Trading up or down in the draft something Reese rarely will do. I highly doubt it, unless it's a really good offer.. The last two i remember were for SInorice Moss and Ramses Barden, and how did those work out?

  7. #17
    All-Pro titwio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AGiantDynasty View Post
    How can you dismiss (for lack of.a better term) my draft and because Rhodes might not be there but yet you can have a 2nd round talent going in the 4th? Rhodes is slated to go around the 15-20th pick, which means we have a realistic chance to get him.
    But you have no draft to dismiss. Your criticizing mine saying you want someone who most likely won't be there and the rest of it is Kasheem Greene? I gave my reasons for why I thought Wilson would be there...can you offer any ideas as to why you would disagree based on my reasoning? I can understand if I didn't explain it but I seriously doubt people are reading anything I put into this just because they don't see the "familiar" names that everyone seems to have in their mock. I gave examples and reasoning to everything I wrote.

    Quote Originally Posted by AGiantDynasty View Post
    Also, why is it so hard to say rd 3 and 4 to draft the BPA OL or DL? This draft has its best depth for OL and DL between the 2nd and 4th rounds. Its very much possible to say draft the BPA at that point.
    Because it's so vague and the Giants don't draft that way. They draft based on value and the best players available. They don't lay out specific plans to draft best OL and DL in certain rounds.

    Quote Originally Posted by AGiantDynasty View Post
    I don't hate your mock, but I certainly feel mine is slightly more possible to actually happen. DT is certainly a need, but a run stuffer DT in the first seems like a huge reach. When was the last run defender the giants took in the 1st rd?
    Can you please list your mock other than listing two players and saying you like your better. On the subject of Jesse Williams he's projected as a mid to late first rounder and his Pro Day only solidified in helping that. He's not just a run stuffer. He's a name right now that is gaining a buzz around his stock. He's 6'4 323 lbs and ran between 4.84 and 4.9. That's faster than some of the top TE prospects. Jerry Reese has made no bones about drafting athletic freaks.

    I don't mind people here criticizing....I actually like it....it gives me a chance to open people up to different possibilities instead of the same, old, repetitive mocks and ideas people just jump on the bandwagon of. I like Alec Ogeltree, Rhodes, Brown and Greene too. I just know the chances of those guys landing in blue are not as likely as people here "want" to think. Things happen, trades are made and players drop.

    People on this site are brutal when they don't see Rhodes or Ogletree mocked to the Giants. LOL
    Last edited by titwio; 03-23-2013 at 02:38 PM.

  8. #18
    All-Pro titwio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TAILGATIN' View Post
    Titwio? Shoulda went with boob instead. Just kiddin but I hate ur mock
    You should drink a lot of Duff beer, get into a car and drive fast. Just kidding but I hate your comment.

  9. #19
    Veteran TAILGATIN''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by titwio View Post
    You should drink a lot of Duff beer, get into a car and drive fast. Just kidding but I hate your comment.
    I was obviously kiddin bud. Way to take it to another level and show ur class, dirtbag.

    "Behold, the tailgate party. The pinnacle of human achievement. Since the dawn of parking lots, man has sought to fill his gut with food and alcohol in anticipation of watching others exercise."
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  10. #20
    All-Pro titwio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TAILGATIN' View Post
    I was obviously kiddin bud. Way to take it to another level and show ur class, dirtbag.
    Wow, thought you'd know I was kidding too. Was just adding to your humor. Not sure why your so offended.

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