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Thread: strange confidence in Eli going into the season

  1. #241
    Quote Originally Posted by gmen46 View Post
    This is a frequent--on this board--statement regurgitated every time the issue of Eli's clutch factor is raised, and it is irrelevant every time. And just plain ridiculous.

    Your statement can be raised about every QB comeback.

    Yet do you say the same thing about Montana and all his comebacks? About Peyton and Brady) comeback ability? About Elway and Marino when they had thrilling comeback games? About Unitas? All of these QBs (and a few others throughout history) have been, and continue to be, praised by anyone you can think of--players, ex players, coaches, pundits, fans, HOF writer-voters--for their extraordinary "comeback ability". Which of these QBs would you say had their comebacks in games that they were more than adequate in the first half?

    This ability is in fact highly regarded in the select few QBs who are good at it throughout their career. And Eli--only at mid career so far--is include in this select group. There's a reason for that.

    Because all players are human. Because football is a team sport and sometimes other components come up short for a while. Because most pro football games have an ebb and flow to them. Because pro football is not like college ball where superior teams routinely play drastically inferior teams to vastly lopsided scores and total number of points can impact post season positioning.

    And because of these facts of pro football life, it is impressive (and highly valued) when the QB can not only lead the team to overcome earlier deficiencies, but can do it repeatedly and can do it in big games as well.
    To be honest I agree with most of what you say...and on the surface makes a lot of sense.....but what my eyes tell me is when Eli is bad he can be really bad....and yet still finds a way to make his comeback....makes it seem all the more dramatic.........other OBs...the good ones the hof guys have bad halves ....my eyes tell me not as often and never seem like AS bad as some of the stuff ELI does....I am really glad you guys ...love Eli ...I love him myself and love having him as my QB.........I love the fact that he can bury himself in the first half and was thoughtful enough to bring a shovel with him to dig himself out in the 2nd ....but to be honest it would be nice to just have a lead and play from ahead once in a while.....IT just seems like we are ALWAYS playing from behind....you do realize that just because I find small things wrong with eli....I am still rooting for him right?
    "When I was 15, I could not believe how dumb my father was.....when I was 25, I could not believe how much he had learned in 10 years"

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  2. #242
    All-Pro Delicreep's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morehead State View Post
    A reasonable person could argue that Eli regressed last season.
    When Drew Breed had a bad year, full of INT's, you said Drew did not regress.

    What was the difference you cited?

    As to he draft drama; he was a man and completely responsible, regardless of who advised him.
    Still bothers me about him.

    It's a privilege to play in the NFL, and he through he was more privileged than others
    Last edited by Delicreep; 06-19-2013 at 04:34 PM.
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  3. #243
    All-Pro B&RWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by repeatchamps View Post
    The Giants O-line in the same years you are referring to has been questionable at best in pass blocking. Sack numbers are irrelevant because Eli has the ability to get rid of the ball very quickly limiting sacks against. Meanwhile Rivers due to various factors takes way more sacks than Eli ever does under a similar pass rush to what Rivers has faced in the last couple of years you are referring to. As mentioned earlier in this thread, I have watched Chargers games on NFL ticket almost as much as I have Giants games and have done so since both guys became starters for their respective teams so I can make my own judgements/comparisons of their careers and I'm telling you without a doubt that over their entire careers Rivers has had the better O-line more times than not.
    Name the years Eli has had bad pass protection. Never! His pass protection has been mediocre at worst. If last year is the worst it's been for Eli, he was the least sacked QB in the league or close to that. Kiper said the number one thing SD needed was Oline help in the draft after last year. If you watched SD last year then you watched Rivers get killed and run for his life all season long.

    We always had good pass protection, it's the run blocking that has been in decline, but pass protection hasn't been spotty until last year. Like I said last year wasn't that bad relative to other teams struggles. Cutler and Rivers would have killed for last years pass protection that Eli had. You could surmise that Eli is just better at getting rid of the ball quickly, which is in part true, but the line did it's part in pass protection.

    In 2011 the line was A+++ for the Giants, not so much in SD.

  4. #244
    All-Pro Rudyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B&RWarrior View Post
    Name the years Eli has had bad pass protection. Never! His pass protection has been mediocre at worst. If last year is the worst it's been for Eli, he was the least sacked QB in the league or close to that. Kiper said the number one thing SD needed was Oline help in the draft after last year. If you watched SD last year then you watched Rivers get killed and run for his life all season long. We always had good pass protection, it's the run blocking that has been in decline, but pass protection hasn't been spotty until last year. Like I said last year wasn't that bad relative to other teams struggles. Cutler and Rivers would have killed for last years pass protection that Eli had. You could surmise that Eli is just better at getting rid of the ball quickly, which is in part true, but the line did it's part in pass protection.In 2011 the line was A+++ for the Giants, not so much in SD.
    In 2011 the line was A++++? O_o
    I thought we had something special!!!

  5. #245
    All-Pro Rudyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B&RWarrior View Post
    That's not an option you have. If I have the option of drafting the #1 pick in the draft I have the rights to the best player available. He should be happy to have a chance to play football for a living.
    K
    I thought we had something special!!!

  6. #246
    All-Pro B&RWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by giantsfan420 View Post
    and for me, its way different with eli making the mistakes hes made, and learning/progressing seadily over the years as opposed to rivers and this huge regresion. eli has had his share of moronic plays. but thats something thats improving over time, not regressing over time like rivers. if eli were making the mistakes he was making in succession, each on worse than the next, and continually getting worse, i'd say the same thing about eli as i am right now about rivers.
    Dude what huge regression are you talking about? You obviously haven't watched Rivers play. 2011 was bad but it was more a really rough patch of games where he played really bad. He picked up his performance near the end of the season, if my memory serves me correct. Last year I thought he played admirably behind a very bad line. Not as good as his first 5 years, but his first 5 years he was looking like a HOFer.

    I thought Eli regressed last year too, but he by no means looked awful for the entire season. In fat he regressed only in light of how well he performed in 2011. In 2011 he looked like a HOF. Will Eli be the QB we saw in 2011 or is 2012 more representative of the play we should expect?

    I say a healthy Nicks and an improved 3rd receiver and an upgraded receiving threat at TE bode well for his future. I think improved run blocking will do wonders for him as well. I'm predicting 2011 performance levels will be the new norm for Eli.

  7. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by B&RWarrior View Post
    Name the years Eli has had bad pass protection. Never! His pass protection has been mediocre at worst. If last year is the worst it's been for Eli, he was the least sacked QB in the league or close to that. Kiper said the number one thing SD needed was Oline help in the draft after last year. If you watched SD last year then you watched Rivers get killed and run for his life all season long.

    We always had good pass protection, it's the run blocking that has been in decline, but pass protection hasn't been spotty until last year. Like I said last year wasn't that bad relative to other teams struggles. Cutler and Rivers would have killed for last years pass protection that Eli had. You could surmise that Eli is just better at getting rid of the ball quickly, which is in part true, but the line did it's part in pass protection.

    In 2011 the line was A+++ for the Giants, not so much in SD.
    I just cannot agree. Perhaps San Diego the last couple years has fallen to a bit worse than the Giants but overall Rivers has had the better O-line. Eli's pass protection has never been great. It is misleading to see the low sack numbers. Eli has always had a ridiculously quick release even in his rookie year. I know what I've seen since 2006 (when both Rivers and Eli were starters). Rivers has had it better for more seasons than Eli. You want to give the nod to Rivers having it worse last year fine but it is by a small margin and no way was 2011 a good year for the Giants pass protection wasn't great for SD either so I consider it a wash. However other than 2008, Rivers had a better o-line in front of him in 2006, 2007, 2009 and 2010.
    Last edited by repeatchamps; 06-19-2013 at 11:18 PM.
    Over 5500 posts, advanced member, joined March 2002. 1st post (as anonymous) was the day after Super Bowl 35

  8. #248
    All-Pro B&RWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rudyy View Post
    In 2011 the line was A++++? O_o
    Think about how man times Eli dropped back. When you played us that year you never game planned for the running game. We had nothing to slow down the pass rush. Pass protections was damn good considering those factors. I don't recall many teams smacking Eli around that year, even though they never had to play the run much. I give the line all the credit in the world.

  9. #249
    All-Pro Rudyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B&RWarrior View Post
    Think about how man times Eli dropped back. When you played us that year you never game planned for the running game. We had nothing to slow down the pass rush. Pass protections was damn good considering those factors. I don't recall many teams smacking Eli around that year, even though they never had to play the run much. I give the line all the credit in the world.
    I don't. That's the reason we were last in rushing, and Eli passed for all those yards. Line was not good by any stretch of the imagination.
    I thought we had something special!!!

  10. #250
    All-Pro Eliscruzzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B&RWarrior View Post
    Name the years Eli has had bad pass protection. Never! His pass protection has been mediocre at worst. If last year is the worst it's been for Eli, he was the least sacked QB in the league or close to that. Kiper said the number one thing SD needed was Oline help in the draft after last year. If you watched SD last year then you watched Rivers get killed and run for his life all season long.

    We always had good pass protection, it's the run blocking that has been in decline, but pass protection hasn't been spotty until last year. Like I said last year wasn't that bad relative to other teams struggles. Cutler and Rivers would have killed for last years pass protection that Eli had. You could surmise that Eli is just better at getting rid of the ball quickly, which is in part true, but the line did it's part in pass protection.

    In 2011 the line was A+++ for the Giants, not so much in SD.
    If you came to the conclusion that the Giants o-line was an A+++ then the only number your looking at, is the times he got sacked, not the whole picture. If our o-line was so good why did we draft one in the first round this year??

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