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  1. #121
    All-Pro Rudyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dillyyo2013 View Post
    Because in the immediacy Eli gives us more and we have time for Nassib to develop. I have no idea whether he is good enough to excel, but we don't risk much my letting him ride the bench and develop. Worked for Rodgers and I think Rodgers is a better QB than Favre was. Unfortunately, with the draft you never know for sure what you are getting. But, if a player like Luck were on the board and I had this opportunity, I wouldn't hesitate at making a move. This is in respects to our current team now because I think we have too many holes that will take considerable time to mend up.
    Read the bold.

    It's obvious the OL is hindering Eli.
    Re-hash the OL and you will see a difference. I have more faith in finding 2-3 quality OL than another franchise QB.

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudyy View Post
    Read the bold.

    It's obvious the OL is hindering Eli.
    Re-hash the OL and you will see a difference. I have more faith in finding 2-3 quality OL than another franchise QB.
    It could be, but my experience has been that once you find those 2-3 OL, you lose other parts. What happens if you find 2 OL, the line plays better, but you lose Nicks and the receivers can't seem to get open? Another year down the tubes. Then the following years you can have injuries, players leaving, etc. Also, we run such a complicated offense that it's not just as easy as lining up and letting the lineman show his talent. You have to learn the system and develop. Very easy to envision the OL coming together right when Eli is on the outs.

    I do believe the O line is hindering Eli and even with their better play as of late, Eli is still shell shocked and not as comfortable in the pocket as he's like to be. Unfortunately, for the aforementioned reasons I stated, I think taking the hypothetical path the OP presented might be a risk worth taking. Eli is not going to get exponentially better and I'm not into winning a SB sprinkled with atrocious seasonal play around those years.

  3. #123
    All-Pro Rudyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dillyyo2013 View Post
    It could be, but my experience has been that once you find those 2-3 OL, you lose other parts. What happens if you find 2 OL, the line plays better, but you lose Nicks and the receivers can't seem to get open? Another year down the tubes. Then the following years you can have injuries, players leaving, etc. Also, we run such a complicated offense that it's not just as easy as lining up and letting the lineman show his talent. You have to learn the system and develop. Very easy to envision the OL coming together right when Eli is on the outs.

    I do believe the O line is hindering Eli and even with their better play as of late, Eli is still shell shocked and not as comfortable in the pocket as he's like to be. Unfortunately, for the aforementioned reasons I stated, I think taking the hypothetical path the OP presented might be a risk worth taking. Eli is not going to get exponentially better and I'm not into winning a SB sprinkled with atrocious seasonal play around those years.
    All of the things you mentioned in the first paragraph are out of Eli's control.

    We don't know if he will be this super saiyan QB with a better line, but I know how well he plays when he has time. That's all I need, and I'm willing to give Eli another year with a better line. Why would you also put an unproven 1st round QB behind this atrocity anyway? Doesn't make any sense.

  4. #124
    All-Pro TCHOF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAnalyst View Post
    Well, none anymore. But when we were 0-6 I said we should do it. I would of expected a 2nd and 5th. A team would of done it. Patriots? Jets? Falcons? 49ers? Seahawks? Ravens? Chiefs? Colts? Teams that felt they were 1 WR away from being a Superbowl contender.

    Then again, TRent Richardson was traded for a 1st rounder. So maybe they could get a 1st.

    This opportunity reminds me of the Yankees and Cano. The Yankees should of traded him and Kuroda during the year. Those 2 would of netted some great prospects for the future. Nicks would of done the same.
    No chance in hell that any team would have given us a 2nd and a 5th for Nicks, much less a first.

  5. #125
    Just going back to the comment about Eli "just being a downfield passer with most success with huge receivers". Not sure who it was so sorry for not quoting directly...

    ..but we've had some of the gaudiest (sp) WR number in Giants history with Smith (5'-11") Cruz (6'-0") and Nicks (6'-1").... and with 2 of them playing out of the slot.

    That perception just doesn't match the reality.
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  6. #126
    All-Pro Roosevelt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dillyyo2013 View Post
    This is why he has always excelled with tall and big receivers. From day one Eli has always had accuracy issues and they tended to fall into the high category. Not saying he can't be accurate, but most often than not, he is not accurate on an Elite level. If he was then I would say no to a draft pick because you could develop a line and good receivers and he would excel ala Brady. Fact is even with a line an receivers Eli has a penchant for just making stupid throws or still be inaccurate.

    Problem is that people only want to use the SB as the only metric to determine his greatness. It's kind of like saying the Heisman winner is always the best player in college when we all know that is a joke most times.

    Winning the Super Bowls are his only metric and that is something that shouldn't be taken lightly.

    Look at his brother. He's a far superior QB with a history of under-performing in the biggest games. Which would you prefer?
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  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudyy View Post
    All of the things you mentioned in the first paragraph are out of Eli's control.

    We don't know if he will be this super saiyan QB with a better line, but I know how well he plays when he has time. That's all I need, and I'm willing to give Eli another year with a better line. Why would you also put an unproven 1st round QB behind this atrocity anyway? Doesn't make any sense.
    We are talking hypotheticals and being offered a top 1 st rd pick for Eli. If we base judgement of all other players on the team on long term prospective then I don't see how you don't seriously weigh your options there. Which way you go depends on many factors, but sure worth spending serious time considering. IMO, the atrocity of the line is a moot point because sometimes the QBs themselves help the line. Ability to slide into open lanes, step in the pocket, scramble, etc. A line that's great for mobile passer might not excel with a pure pocket passer. Nonetheless, an ATG QB developed in Dallas while getting pummeled his first season at 1-15. The line ended up being probably the best line ever (thanks in good part to Herschel Walker) and troy ended up leading them to 3 SBs.

    Like I said before, to many factors impact the results of whichever decision you choose, but purely based on talent replacement and possibilities, I think it's a no brainier to risk on a draft, assuming there is a top prospect like that available.

  8. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by Roosevelt View Post
    Winning the Super Bowls are his only metric and that is something that shouldn't be taken lightly.

    Look at his brother. He's a far superior QB with a history of under-performing in the biggest games. Which would you prefer?
    I disagree. I would much rather have Peyton and 1 SB with let downs in between than 2 SBs and years of some of the most historically abysmal play the game has known. It's maddening and at least I know that every year I will be in the hunt and enjoying my team throughout the cold months. Quality over quantity for me.

  9. #129
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    The Giants have greater needs than QB

  10. #130
    All-Pro GameTime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dillyyo2013 View Post
    I disagree. I would much rather have Peyton and 1 SB with let downs in between than 2 SBs and years of some of the most historically abysmal play the game has known. It's maddening and at least I know that every year I will be in the hunt and enjoying my team throughout the cold months. Quality over quantity for me.
    you would make a poor NFL owner. Lombardi Trophies are the ultimate goal and accomplishment.
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