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  1. #181
    All-Pro B&RWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morehead State View Post
    And ultimately that seems to be what he is......a complimentary back who can make some plays.
    I think if folks stay healthy we will see Jennings as our workhorse back with Wilson as a change of pace back. That is of course if he learns to pass protect.
    I think they will split carries. He's got a toughness about his running style. I think he will get more touches than you think. I'm not sold on Jennings. When I watched his highlight tapes I saw a guy running through some big holes with the Raiders. He's a strong runner that is hard to bring down and is a good receiver, but he's not elusive, and he doesn't have great speed. He seems a shade better than Hillis, but not by much.
    In the tough times we find out who we are...that's why I know VC will be back better than ever in 2015. #80 NYG4life!

  2. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by gmen46 View Post
    He lost 1. That's what counts.

    What is misleading is when the total fumbles is interchanged with lost fumbles in order to make a point. Happens all the time on this board, not directing this at you per se.

    Wilson lost 3 fumbles in 121 touches (2.5%) his first 2 yrs.

    Tiki lost 1 fumble in 264 touches (0.38%) his first 2 yrs

    That was the point being made in response to the poster who asked how many fumbles Tiki had his first 2 yrs, while obviously attempting to mitigate the high fumble percentage by Wilson so far. Apples to apples. You're inadvertently introducing oranges into the comparison.
    Im sorry, that is nonsense and you know it. You tried to mislead by making a silly comparison.

    By your logic, Tiki shouldn't have been held accountable for his fumbles because they happened to bounce to his teammates? Conversely, Wilson should be benched because his teammates didn't do a good enough job recovering his fumbles. Who recovers the fumble isn't the Rbs responsibility. His responsibility is to not fumble or limit them.



    Da'Rel Scott was benched his rookie year and never really got back on the field because he fumbled 2 times in 5 carries( the second 1 was incorrectly ruled down and not challenged by the opponent because of down and distance) Despite it not being ruled a fumble and no turnover officially occurring it was still good enough for TC to bench him...basically forever.

    Furthermore, it was widely reported that Tiki had problems holding onto the football in practice too. Lets not revise history and try to make it like Tiki's fumble problem wasn't that bad simply because his teammates saved his behind by recovering his fumbles.

  3. #183
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    We're going to have 3, maybe 4 new o-lineman next year and your saying it was Wilsons fault he was getting hit in the back field? And its ok to give certain backs 10-15 carries before he "gets started". I don't think Wilson got 10-15 carries all of last year. [dont give me stats] Point is you can't teach speed. Give him the ball next year.

  4. #184
    All-Pro Morehead State's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B&RWarrior View Post
    I think they will split carries. He's got a toughness about his running style. I think he will get more touches than you think. I'm not sold on Jennings. When I watched his highlight tapes I saw a guy running through some big holes with the Raiders. He's a strong runner that is hard to bring down and is a good receiver, but he's not elusive, and he doesn't have great speed. He seems a shade better than Hillis, but not by much.
    I see 1200 yards from Jennings. and maybe 300 more in the passing game.
    He's a better back than people think.
    Get well soon 80.

  5. #185
    All-Pro gmen46's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by speedman View Post
    Your point is a guy who fumbles 10 times and he or his teammates recover 9 of them is not a fumbler?
    My point is that a runner who fumbles 3 times and loses all 3 to the opponent is 3 times worse than one who fumbles 10 times but has 9 of them recovered by his offense, yes.

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by gmen46 View Post
    My point is that a runner who fumbles 3 times and loses all 3 to the opponent is 3 times worse than one who fumbles 10 times but has 9 of them recovered by his offense, yes.
    Unbelievable. Good thing you're not a talent evaluator. Your logic is so flawed.
    Engage brain before speaking.

  7. #187
    All-Pro gmen46's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueSanta View Post
    Im sorry, that is nonsense and you know it. You tried to mislead by making a silly comparison.

    By your logic, Tiki shouldn't have been held accountable for his fumbles because they happened to bounce to his teammates? Conversely, Wilson should be benched because his teammates didn't do a good enough job recovering his fumbles. Who recovers the fumble isn't the Rbs responsibility. His responsibility is to not fumble or limit them.



    Da'Rel Scott was benched his rookie year and never really got back on the field because he fumbled 2 times in 5 carries( the second 1 was incorrectly ruled down and not challenged by the opponent because of down and distance) Despite it not being ruled a fumble and no turnover officially occurring it was still good enough for TC to bench him...basically forever.

    Furthermore, it was widely reported that Tiki had problems holding onto the football in practice too. Lets not revise history and try to make it like Tiki's fumble problem wasn't that bad simply because his teammates saved his behind by recovering his fumbles.
    What "silly comparison" are you talking about?

    My points about Tiki and his (lack of) fumble problem was in response to someone who asked about his first 2 years. His first 3 years, actually, Tiki did not have a "fumble problem".

    It was his next 4 years, the exact middle of his 10 yr career, which were the 4 years preceding Coughlin's arrival in 2004, that Barber had his problems. The following 3 years--first 3 of Coughlin and the 3 yrs of his career he had the most carries and yds ea. of the 3 yrs----he fumbled the ball a total of 9 times with 4 lost. In 3 years. In just the year before Coughlin he fumbled 9 times and lost 6.

    Scott didn't make it, in the end, because he contributed little-to-nothing in the run game and the return game. The couple fumbles didn't help, but that's not why he was cut. You're the one "revising history" here.
    Last edited by gmen46; 03-23-2014 at 04:41 PM.

  8. #188
    All-Pro gmen46's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by speedman View Post
    Unbelievable. Good thing you're not a talent evaluator. Your logic is so flawed.
    Really. My logic doesn't align with yours, so it's automatically "flawed".

    A non-turnover equals a turnover, and that's your idea of "logic". OK

    I miss the old signature of Roanoke Fan

  9. #189
    Quote Originally Posted by gmen46 View Post
    Really. My logic doesn't align with yours, so it's automatically "flawed".

    A non-turnover equals a turnover, and that's your idea of "logic". OK

    I miss the old signature of Roanoke Fan
    Not talking about turnovers everyone was talking about fumbles. I don't think there are many people that would agree that someone who fumbles 3 times and loses all 3 is 3 times worse than someone who fumbles 10 times and is lucky enough to only lose 1.
    Engage brain before speaking.

  10. #190
    All-Pro B&RWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmen46 View Post
    My point is that a runner who fumbles 3 times and loses all 3 to the opponent is 3 times worse than one who fumbles 10 times but has 9 of them recovered by his offense, yes.
    So the key to limiting turnovers is not having a running back that doesn't fumble, but surrounding the running back with good fumble recoverers. Okay Gmen46. So clearly Wilson shouldn't have been benched at all, we should have benched the players around him that did not recover the fumbles.

    You're a good poster, but this argument is surprisingly flawed.
    In the tough times we find out who we are...that's why I know VC will be back better than ever in 2015. #80 NYG4life!

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